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What happened to Cassy and his push to create a wildland series or attach to the current federal fire fighter series? It seemed like is was moving forward.
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I don’t know. I know he’s trying. I won’t speak for the association and I greatly respect his efforts.
I do know that all associations need active members and money to succeed.
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The first thing that needs to change is call them Firefighters. All ranks in the Federal Firefighting need significant equity raises in pay, benefits and retirement. Don’t be fooled the IAFF is working hard behind the scene to keep any of this from happening. IAFF members need to step up and demand the union leadership at least support the Federal Brothers.
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Oh… I’ll regret it but I’ll jump in… so why does the iaff want to keep them labeled differently? Is that from the fed structure for the original creation of the Service… or has the iaff somehow corrupted the gov to keep them oppressed?
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Certainly not an expert and barely a novice on federal labor laws. Just wanted to put that out there.
To the best of my knowledge, Federal employees have no collective bargaining rights when it comes to pay, benefits and retirement. I really don’t know what IAFF could do for us other than being a stronger voice. Our union does make recommendations on pay, benefits and retirement to administrations. They do testify before Congress.
unfortunately only a couple types of individuals that would I recommend go to fed firefighting anymore these days. Anyone truly interesting in firefighting as a career, I mostly point them towards local and state departments.
I know firefighters, great friends, who are perfectly satisfied with being a firefighter the whole career at LG departments. You can’t realistically do that with the Feds. The physical toll on your body is too much especially in the 40-50’s and the pay and retirement is too low.
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I agree… it seems impossible to career an agency like that where the support is not there. The employees making it to retirement are broke off. Retention always seems a mess with fed/state because even as much as you love the agency and the job… the machine just eats you up. I would sure hope there is some way possible to get that strong voice to make change for them.
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What I find interesting is that upper agency managers either don’t see this or refuse to believe it.
Right now each forest and the region are hiding actual numbers of firefighting modules that are unstaffed or under staffed.
They know they can keep this under the radar. Unless…
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as a member of IAFF AN HAVE AT LEAST 40 YEARS OF FIRELAND FIREFIGHTING I HOPE TO ASSURE ALL THAT IAFF AND ALL LGS HAVE SUPPORTED THE CLASSIFICATION OF OUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS BEING CLASSIFIED AS WE ARE: FIREFIGHTERS, ENOUGH SAID.
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iF I MAY ADD ? THESE ARE ALL FIREFIGHTERS BROTHERS AND SISTERS; BOTH INTERFACE AND WILD-LAND.
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What do you do with the FS forestry tech who only fights fire 3 months out of the year? Do they have 2 qualifications, 3 months your a FS fire fighter and 9 months a forest tech? What happens when a fire breaks out in December (Great Smokey Mt’s National Park), and all your employees are forestry techs. A good union rep will not want to let Forestry Techs come fight that fire, that’s crossing the union line). Can you cross over and do double duty throughout the year? Will the union allow a forestry tech to fight fire? Can a firefighter repair a trails during the winter? If you are a firefighter, and you work in R5, does that mean the hot shots are firefighters also and as a firefighter do you have to loose the beard if the union says all firefighters are to be clean shaven for BA’s. And what about type 2 crews? What are they classified as? And how does a FMO on a forest back east get firefighters to come work for them if fire season is only 3 months long. They what a forest tech who can work year round and just do firefighting when necessary.
I see a whole lot of trouble creating a separate series for a firefighting classification when you only fight fire a couple of months out of the year. And as a former Forestry Tech in CA, i see a whole bunch of problems just here in CA, let alone the federal lands back East and South.; And I want the current forestry techs reclassified.
When it comes to actual days working on fire I’d say R5 federal Forestry techs spend more shifts working fire in a year than most of the municipal “Firefighters” out there, also as for winter time we mostly do fuels reduction which is fire prevention. I know there will be some issues with implementation of a firefighter status but we deserve more than what we currently have.
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With a mounting number of requirements these days, most of the of the winter for feds is fuels work, including RX Fire, prevention, training, initial attack staffing, training and a multitude of other fire preparedness activities.
Probably one of the reasons all R5 Firefighters from the Senior Firefighter level up are now employed year round.
So much off season preparedness work and initial attack and other response activities that some R5 Forests are asking to hire firefighter temporaries during the winter.
Hello all, thank you for this discussion, it’s about time it’s getting some attention. Now, let me say I know very little about the acronyms you all have used, I am not in fire or in any related field. However, as the wife of a USFS Supt. Of a Hotshot Crew in R-5 going on season 18, I know enough. I can clarify a few things that were mentioned throughout all these responses. My husband is a GS-9 step ? Forestry Technician. He is away from home over one hundred days & nights, (give or take 5-7 days either way) out of 365 days. All of those days & nights are fire fighting, rx burning, or fire training/teaching of some sort. Before he became a capt. there was some sort of union however that became obsolete after he climbed the ranks. I do know that when he became permanent there is a signed document stating that he can no longer petition against the agency/govt as in a STRIKE. So I will venture a guess that this is why many “forestry technicians” cannot openly voice their valid concerns, I know this is why mine is more passive on this matter. I can also add that we have discussed many times over the years about how time earned & retirement is transferred if he were to go in another direction, but unfortunately with more speculation than actual answers it’s always been what if’s on our part. I am excited about the chatter I’ve been hearing more this year than any of the past years about title, pay, etc. My husband on the other hand is a bit more reserved, not wanting to get high hopes, specially when he has this many years in. he is still a beast out there in the fire world, but yes the years with this agency have definitely been taking their toll, physically & mentally. With the stressors of being on the front line of fire, being away from home, & all the bureaucracy crap, it’s all very disturbing that with so much on his shoulders he is still just a forestry technician! And yet, in & out burgers can pay their flippers more per hour than he made for many of his years on the line. Anyway just a wife’s two cents on the matter.
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Does the FS have enough applicants applying for the number of open positions?
That’s takes an answer with a couple layers. Some forests yes, some no. Depending on position and location. The ones that do have applicants, the lists are a lot short than they were 5 to 10 years ago. A lot of turn over at the GS-4 to GS-7/8 rank.
The Congresswomen who were attacked today and told to go back to the countries for which they came from, voted to increase Wildland Firefighter pay to a level higher than anything seen for 8 years. Supported a bill to allow for Wildland Firefighters to be paid during government shutdowns. Voted for the 911 responders health bill. Voted to pass family leave.
If a Wildland Firefighter would have said those words to a coworker, they would have been immediately referred for a administrative investigation.
Normalization of deviance matters. This is not normal.
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The old governmental double standard. Congressional two step etc. Hope there is a reprimand coming.
To ensure we’re clear. These women are Americans. Born in the USA. Duly elected members of Congress by other Americans.
Although some, maybe including me don’t agree with every position they take, we thank them for their support to Federal Wildland Firefighters and their service to our country.
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Today the people’s House voted to give a “significant” pay raise for entry level Wildland Firefighters by passing a phased in $15 an hour national minimum wage. One can debate the pros and cons of a national $15 minimum wage.
More importantly considering the health and life risks, does it really need to take a House vote on a national minimum wage of $15 an hour to give a significant raise to Wildland Firefighters, just to make them minimum wage workers?
Sit back and let that sink in.
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