Help me understand the point that you are trying to make, fire season in the NW west will be soon ending, look at the WX coming in, it’s over…
My bad I should have read into it a little deeper, agreed, much bigger and more destructive fires…indeed
many contributing factors, climate change is the big one, but there are other factors within our control that if addressed would certainly help…just saying…
Honestly you stating we’re not “runnin and gunnin” in the off season is quite disrespectful. With all the fuels targets, no roads department, no rec employees, and still having to staff all winter long I feel like a 2 week fire assignment is a vacation. We routinely end up with 2 to 300 hrs OT before May, so ya, we’re still busy. Also with the state of our fire staffing or lack thereof, we end up getting shit for requesting to use our annual leave.
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I often tell my boss, “I need a break from work, can I go to a fire?”
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Running and Gunning-Defined by running to one fire after the next…I am very certain that this does not occur in the winter…As I said all fire seasons come to an end…some later than others…As for working hard in the winter…you bet…that’s the job…it’s year round work…it’s always been year round…going to a fire to catch a break…COME ON! Really…Maybe that true…Aggressive suppression may be a thing of the past, I come from a forest where we got after it…lay hose and punch line…that’s the job…When you reach the 8 hr leave cat you will have plenty of time to rest…We would do well to take a look at the private sector…those that work out of doors…they for the most part work way harder that we do in every inclimate condition you can imagine, when it below zero or 100 + they are there to fix it…Entitlement Aughhhhhhh! just go to work and be happy that you have a job…As I have said you all need better, as you are holding your breath waiting for it go do something…
I know that I sound out of touch, as I see it the job has not changed a wink, it’s still the same, all the same issues, better pay and benefits, I really hope you see it sooner than later…in the mean time there is a mission that needs your attention…Peace…
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When fire season is “over” i’m burning piles 6 days a week for another month. and yes, going to a fire is a “break” for me. I’d much rather run a division than go to IDT meetings, deal with G&As, get away from being a COR on 6 contracts and all the other “catch all” duties I do. Fighting fire is the easy part of my job
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I started with the “old school” times about 20 yrs ago and have been seeing the changes within the last 3-4 years I would say. My perspective is that it’s not the same as it used to be. It’s just not, in any aspect, honestly. I always hear the argument - “ you knew what you signed up for”. I laugh at that one. I did, but now it’s not relevant. It all has changed. I wish it was the same because 20-15 years ago it was a great job and a lot easier and straight forward. It was also a lot less demanding. It was how you explain it. We could go out and just work if you know what I mean. I absolutely agree that going on a fire is like a vacation to get away from all the challenges at the home unit. Personally, I feel the winter months are just as busy and more challenging than the summer months. The RX, maintenance, hiring, training etc. coupled with the now common resource orders make it rough. We all have different perspectives based on experiences and this is mine. If yours is different, right on!
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I guess the way I see it is that it’s just work, you put in a day and then go home and come back and do it again until that day you retire, yes, on the admin side of things there have been real significant changes in the last 20 yrs, mostly with the USFS, I retired from the NPS, we still had admin support.
I f you need to go to a fire to catch a break, great…I guess. Why not ie camp support…I was always for home turf fires, I could go home and sleep in my own bed…in my 38 yrs I never felt like I caught a break by going to a fire…just saying…
Yes we had hard targets in the winter, build piles and burn them…but we had plenty of down time as well…it’s the fed gov, it’s not hard whip cracking 24/7, never has been…if you are a double digit GS, you should be pulling a heavy load earning that top pay…Again I hope you all get better every thing…Better pay needs to be all inclusive…all fed folks that go out on fires…ie the militia…
The Big Red wave is coming and spending will be coming to an abrupt halt, hope they figure it out soon, before it’s to late…
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This is intended for the thread as a whole. I think we’re missing the point a bit. The reason we’re here is because we care.
In any business if you lose employees at a 30-40% rate year over year, you are going to have a lot of issues. It doesn’t necessarily matter whether or not the job has changed, although I think it has in my 15 years here.
The point is when a business of any kind or size hemorrhages employees at that rate, it’s going to fail or at least be highly stressed. Though the issue has been around for 30+ years doesn’t mean there’s not a problem… it’s just a long lived problem. Keep fighting all.
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Agreed! Hard to argue w/ your logic…Keep pressing on…you have no choice but to do so…
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“NFFE Sets Organizing Record by Adding Over 100 New Union Members in a Single Week | National Federation of Federal Employees” NFFE Sets Organizing Record by Adding Over 100 New Union Members in a Single Week | National Federation of Federal Employees
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Nice job NFFE. Time to go fight for em.
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As I recall back in the early/mid 90’s a great many of us in CA/R-5 and maybe elsewhere joined the union that Casey Judd was leading, not real sure if this is the same thing, https://www.fwfsa.org/, what have we really accomplished in the 30+ yrs for our rank and file, here’s a shocker…NOTHING!!!
I remember paying my dues, maybe 25$ a pay period, thinking now we will see some changes…GS-6 Hotshot Forman trying to raise a family on one income…
I do hope the very best for you all, you could sign up 10,000 new members and it would not move it one inch towards better anything…it’s a farce… Good Luck!!!
I sure would like a WFSA decal, if anyone knows how to find one…
It’s not the same “union” your talking about and NFFE does indeed have accomplishments to show. Changes have already happened with more to come. We aren’t living in the early 90s as some may continue to think.
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FWFSA is NOT a union.
USFS Update: Wildland firefighter pay, classification in infrastructure law
Oct. 28, 2022: Update on wildland firefighter pay
Our Human Resources Management Pay Branch continues to work nonstop to ensure wildland firefighters receive the appropriate temporary compensation increases outlined in the Bipartisan Infrastructure Law. This small but nimble group is prioritizing the payments that make the largest impacts on their fellow employees and the significant volume of tickets for specific cases.
Out of the 11,998 retention incentives submitted to NFC, the HR Pay team experienced errors with 435 employees. The errors were a result of multiple actions on these employees hitting the NFC system at the same time (WGIs, promotions, reassignments, TLPs, etc.). The team is working now to manually process each of these actions by the end of October and we expect payments within the next two pay periods. They will recheck for shortfalls and ensure these employees are made whole with appropriate lump sum payments. If you are one of these employees: I know it’s frustrating to experience a delay and have to open a ticket. But please know our HR team is working as quickly as possible to resolve these issues.
Here is a quick summary of the other tasks our HRM team is working on:
- Final calculations for FLSA adjustments are being reviewed this week.
- Outstanding balances are scheduled to be settled by the end of January 2023.
- Payments for employees who have transferred to the Forest Service from DOI or vice versa are being handled expeditiously.
- Separation payments are addressed promptly.
In all instances, the experts in the Pay Branch are conscientiously reviewing individual cases to ensure deposits are accurate. It takes time to serve all Forest Service wildland firefighters, but the effort is worth it. We don’t want anyone to get a bill from Uncle Sam for an overpayment!
Washington Office staff are also working on a permanent pay solution with OPM, OMB and DOI to take effect when the BIL funds are exhausted. This work is exceptionally detailed and takes time. We continue to appreciate your patience and understanding that we are doing our best work on behalf of our valued coworkers.
Please enlighten me as to what has been accomplished, and please leave the temporary pay incentive off the the list of accomplishments, oh it’s great to be sure, but you all need to see real long term pay improvements…
I remember the grade creeping exercise that we all worked so hard on, so cal received a 25% pay increase for our FF’s, ( I am Sure inflation has wiped that out) our engines and shot crews saw real change, a Supt used to be a GS-7, ENGB GS 6…We all worked hard on writing new PD’s and having them reclassified.
You all keep up the good fight and you also will see real change, it may not look like cal fire when it’s all said and done, but it will be a definite improvement…
Thanks for the history lesson…I now recall that it was an association. duh!
We received true over time because of Bill Clinton, someone got his ear and told him what was up…that was jacked being caped at what a DR made base…so yes things have improved much, most of our change came thru internal efforts…Peace…Oh yes we also had support of top brass…
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Everything negotiated and agreed to in the Master Agreement which as a supervisor I lean on all the time to make sure employees are being treated fairly. It’s concerning how much of it is either ignored or unknown. I’m guessing you had to buy yourself your boots? Not anymore! May seem like a small thing but an extra $500 every 3 years for required PPE is great. Also, an extra RR day is pretty rad. I appreciate it. Not to mention having a voice to the decision makers above to look out for the interest of employees is an accomplishment I’d say. I’m sure their is more I’m unaware of. Power is in the numbers. Read up about them. Go through the MA.
There are the people who sit around and talk about the reasons why we can’t get something done and there are the people who figure out how to get it done. Professional problem solvers is who we need to be.
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Okay, these things you mention, are not a result of an external association/union, these are internal, as you said we have a voice, and very often we are listen to by those that have the authority to make changes…I have only been retired for a little over 3 yrs, I nearly fell out of my chair when they announced a boot stipend, and as a supervisor I always had the ability to give my folks more R&R, I guess working for the feds is not so terrible is it…My generation in fire made pleanty of positive changes…a lot…Pay…Equipment…PPE…Training…On and On…Peace…
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I really do appreciate the boot allowance but when you break it down it comes to about $0.08 for every hour of base pay worked, add in OT that drops to about 5 to 6 cents an hour. Not knocking it at all but now that we receive said boot allowance all the good boots are now over $500 a pair.
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