Yep. That’s what I’m hearing from just as reliable of a source.
If you want a chance at a 66, stay on the engine/crew. Everything else goes to a 4 or 5 day 72 at a reduced hourly rate.
Good luck filling all those admin spots.
I heard this was going to help with retention that’s funny cause now I bet you guys see a mass exodus well done.
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If this is true, and we agree to this, we deserve to be the lowest paid. If you don’t fight against this (if it’s true) than we are just as negligent as anyone. Don’t agree to it. Sometimes drastic times call for things like a recall, and don’t be threatened by, “if we don’t take this, they may come back with less” statements. What do you think happens when the 56 is introduced??
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So first things first, while I understand the communication has been lacking, I think there’s a lot of emotions tied into a lot of this and understandably so. But everyone needs to take a chill pill. We are working ourselves into a frenzy over essentially rumor and it’s causing so much misinformation it’s not even funny anymore. I know where information is lacking, people will insert their own, and then that unverified information becomes fact because they heard it from Tom who heard from John, who heard from his cousins friend. I do not want to see a benefits package of anything less than what we have, communication from 2881 can be better, but we have to stop riling up the masses with speculation. It’s causing unnecessary stress on so many members who just want to do their job. Quite frankly there’s only two groups I want to hear from, L2881 and CAL HR. Once we hear from them, then we can pick the best course of action. Until then stop stressing yourselves out. We should only make decisions based on factual information.
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Well, here’s the thing. The department openly solicited transfers to the new training center today. It seems there should be some clarity on what they’d be transferring into or could be giving up when they take one of those staff jobs. The employees deserve to know all the details before signing a two year commitment. That’s 35+ people that could be sorely disappointed come Nov 1.
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Well…as I indicated in my last sentence we should only be making decisions based on facts and not on speculation. Good for the department in trying to solicit people, but until they provide facts, don’t act. Simple as that in my eyes.
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Appreciate the perspective. But I also respectfully disagree. When we get zero information, and I mean zero. At this point, I’d be happy to hear Tim got up and went to the office. So yes, I too wish that were the case CAL hR and 2881 giving information. But people have legitimate reasons to ask questions. Biggest watch out is lack of common communication. We pay for a product and that product is working conditions. Are there rules to bargaining, yes. We all know that. But at some point don’t you make some sort of address. This is a huge change and to twittle my thumbs waiting for information seems like a laissez-faire approach. When you consider what is being asked. It’s not a lot. Simply provide some information. Even if it’s just the simple fact that, we are at the bargaining table and working towards our message of “No loss in Compensation”. Simple. Even better have your lawyer draw up the statement. That way you don’t get yourself into any waters that violate bargaining rules. It’s obvious this whole 66 is happening and that’s what the JMLC worked on. Now its time to find out the actual nuts and bolts of it.
And quite frankly to insinuate a silence of another’s members opinion is exactly what is wrong with this all. I am entitled to it. So is everyone else here, as you are. As I said I appreciate you speaking your mind. But to silence other voices while stating yours is not a healthy dialogue atmosphere. What you are seeing is the direct result of what members want.
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I can assure you that the entire 2881 team is working day and night for the membership, so, no, he probably hasn’t spent much time at the office…just countless days at the capitol fighting the good fight, meeting with department leadership, planning with the bargaining team, supporting the endless grievances, and doing all those other things that your Union does for you behind the scenes.
There may be something to be desired on the communications front, but I promise you that nobody at 2881 is just sitting around on the couch eating Bon Bons waiting for something to happen.
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While I appreciate that you feel the way you do, I have never insinuated that you be silent. My question though is what does stirring the pot and causing panic gain for us? Absolutely nothing. I understand everyone’s concern as I’m literally in the same boat as you. But I ask myself this question. What do I gain from worrying about something that is so far beyond my control it’s not funny? What if they come and say everyone gets a 25% bump in salary? My point is not for anyone to be silent, but rather be patient. Be vocal when it’s time to be vocal, and right now, there’s nothing any of us can do to change the direction of bargaining. That’s voted for at convention and addressed in the 1500 handbook. The time to be vocal and address the concerns is when it’s presented to us for a vote. I promise you, if this thing is a dumpster fire of an agreement I’d be the first to point out that this is a loser. But to me it seems like misdirected energy right now. We don’t gain anything by it, and we definitely don’t lose anything either. I am by no means defending 2881 or the department, but more concerned about the people who are worried about something we have no information on. I hope that presents a better illustration of what I’m saying and again I apologize if you felt that I was trying to silence you or anyone else.
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I’ve been retired a spell now, but some things never seem to change. A little Transparency goes a long ways. Obviously the bargaining team can’t spill out everything they are doing. So many times we were told at meetings by the union just before voting never came to be and wound up being giveaways at the last minute to secure the ‘core’ of the contract… Some of those things were important to us and were one reason we voted the way we did. I sure wish you guys luck on all this.
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I appreciate that. I get what you are saying and I don’t think anyone is eating Bon Bons, unless they are stress eating. Which may be happening. I want to hope in my heart of hearts you all are right, and that my words are irrational rants and yelling fire when it’s only a dust cloud. I truly hope that. My plan for the worst training tells me to think of what can happen, and yes, at this point I hope the trigger points don’t happen. But I think it’s also important to discuss and plan for what the downside of this all could be. As I said I really hope I’m wrong. And thank you for the reminder of the opposite perspectives
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They can not give us a 25% raise because of the agreement calHR made with CDCR. Didn’t you pay attention to the last contracts powerpoint 
Here is my two cents. L2881 walks into calHR and says we want our entry FAE’s to make 100k base ($34hr) a year on a 48/96. Anything over 56 hours a week is OT ($51hr)
That would force the hand of calHR to lower to 56 because the OT would kill their budget.
I know negotiations aren’t that simple but it would help our retention
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We already approved the 66hr… I do not get why people aren’t understanding this point. When we ratified the last contract, that was approving the 66hr duty week without knowing any of the details whatsoever. Which is why there was a contingent of us that were urging members to vote NO on the ratification, we would have liked to see the bargaining team to go back to CalHR and figure out what exactly we were agreeing too BEFORE we agreed to it.
The membership was just told vote yes and we would figure out the details later. We were sold a bill of good and told if we vote no we will get less. I asked Peter Boctor in person, if the negotiating team received an official Last, Best and Final Offer (LBFO) from CalHR and he said no the contract brought to the membership was not an official LBFO. Which means under the Dills Act, we could have rejected the contract and the state, by law, would have had to continue negotiating in good faith or L2882 could have sued the state for unfair labor practice. Offering us anything less than what was already offered would also be an unfair labor practice and the state could have been sued by L2881.
So basically we are left with two options as to why members were told if we vote no the state will offer less. Either our union officers are simply incompetent and do not understand the Dills Act or the members were lied to. I know my opinion, I will let you all come to your own.
One last thing, the bargaining team is not under an NDA from the state during bargaining. Not releasing information or updates is L2881 own policy in the bylaws. Other bargaining units regularly put out updates during bargaining, even going as far as polling their members and using that polling data to go back the CalHR to show them the current offer is not good enough and will not be accepted by their members. I suggested to several high ranking officials that after bargaining they should release all of the offers received and the notes from the bargaining meetings for transparency. Other wise how do we as members know the bargaining team didn’t take the first offer received. I was basically told to pound sand. L2881 is not transparent and that is an issue with many members. I could go on but I will stop here.
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Thanks for this. What I remember about the meeting and vote was a 6.6%? Pay raise (which we lost most of now?) and approval to fund a working group to study the 66 and come back to us with what it would look like. I def do not remember any talk, bold words or verbage saying we were voting on the 66 to sale to CalHr. I’ve heard this resounded countless times the last years. It’s what so many members are frustrated about. Who are all these extra people? Where are they going? “You know, the 66” I mean WTH is the 66? 3 years +- and the union members know nothing. CF is advertising jobs due to the 66 being funded. And we get told by safeguarding members, “make wise decisions b4 you leap” What is that? Really? Give me a break, or better yet some info.
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Not just creating. Filling. My battalion already has positions called 66HR. And I remember the same as you as far as a working group.
The bottom line though, if it’s less money vote no.
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Yes 6.5% raise, along with approving of the 66hr duty week and changing our fixed rate prefunding of post-employment healthcare to an adjustable rate which can be adjusted .5% annually. If someone is trying to sell me on something, I always feel like they’re lying to me about something so I do my research.
All the members needed to do was read the summary of the contract from CalHR.
See point one under Reducing the 72hr Duty Week in section IV. It very clear states we were approving the 66hr duty week. We agreed to something we didn’t know the details of.
Everyone needs to read what they are agreeing to, don’t just believe what someone from the union tells you.
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Why in bargaining do we always get, “ if we don’t accept the offer, the State will likely reduce their offer”. Whenever it comes to ratification time there is always that inserted insinuation of we need to accept what is offered or be prepared to get less. It’s used on membership every time. And it works every time… I guess if it ain’t broke don’t fix it.
I’m not saying they are wrong but isnt that a little like vote tampering. Simply put the information out and let the members vote and it’s always under a time crunch so we don’t get to ask a lot of questions. Just wondering… or am I crazy.
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The membership is told that because either the union officers are incompetent and do not understand the Dills act or they are lying to you.
The state legally can’t offer us less if we reject a contract ratification. All that would happen is CalHR and L2881 would have to continue negotiating in good faith until and agreement could be reached. At which point the agreed upon wage increases so I’ll be retroactive back the end of the last contract expiration. There are other bargaining units who have turned down contracts and gone back to negotiations.
L2881 has never rejected a contract ratification. If you were negotiating with a group of employees that always says yes to every contract, what would you offer them? I know I would offer the absolute lowest offer I think they would accept. Not to mention slipping in something like the change to OPEB from fixed rate to adjustable rate.
Dills Act - CHAPTER 10.3. State Employer-Employee Relations [3512 - 3524]
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This is simple politics they play the game well and everyone just falls in line. Don’t ever take someone’s word like I say always do your homework do your one research. Cal HR isn’t going to give you guys anything without taking something seems to happen every time.
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You nailed it!! Nothing is free. In 2022 CalHr was under the gun because the budget was flush with COVID CASH and other ONE TIME money. Most other bargaining units took 1-time lump sum for medical. The dollar amount ranged from $4000-6500 Or so.
We took $6240 ($260 x 24mo) NO BARGAINING UNITS got that money as PERSABLE. We also got that $260/mo factored in to Base pay calculation for OT rate. The union can “claim” they don’t agree with the decision, but as has been stated, Tim signed every page of the agreement. THE UNION KNEW!, THE UNION LAWYERS KNEW! So the letter sent from union and attorneys is DISINGENUOUS. Put another way, BE HONEST, UP FRONT
Integrity - Doing the right thing, when nobody is looking. This is now a value in our Strategic Plan Transforming Tomorrow.
Please don’t “piss on my leg and tell me it’s raining”
All of us are now work 10-21 days W/O a break. Working literally hundreds of hours of Unplanned OT, away from our families for the foreseeable future with 3 IMT activations currently. Personally, I will be taking about $1500/mo pay cut($260 + 1.69/hr) for every hour of OT I work. It won’t take 6 WP to give back every dime I EARNED in medical and OT Benifits.
CalHr & the political class wants to WEAR US DOWN.
Be honest, be upfront, BE TRANSPARENT!
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