Curious if anyone has a source for a list of the most destructive wildfires. Google is clogged by the current events but I suspect with over 5,000 structures deemed a total loss the Palisades/Eaton fires have to be up there?
1 Like
see the cal fire website, scroll to the footer, choose Statistics, scroll down a bit - you’ll see three links “most destructive”, “largest” and “deadliest” - only covers State of California, tho’! Also, for So Cal residents to reference - none of the previous So Cal disasters in local memories qualify in the top 20 any more, so I looked up them up for comparison:
Paint Fire, June 1990, Santa Barbara, 641 structures lost
Bel Air fire, Nov 1961, LA City, 505 structures lost
Laguna Fire, 1993, Orange County, 441 structures lost
Laguna Fire, 1970, San Diego, 382 structures lost
Panorama Fire, 1980, San Bernardino, 325 structures lost
2 Likes
Define “destructive.” I don’t particularly care for “structures lost” because houses can be rebuilt, and “dollar value” tends to spike in areas full of the very wealthy. Combine the two and it’s basically “this really rich suburb full of millionaires will displace them to their fourth home for a year or two.” Sucks for them, yeah, but a million acres of forest that’ll take a hundred years to regrow sure moves the needle a lot more to me.
4 Likes
The “official” numbers put out by Cal Fire use this definition for “destructive fires”:
“Structures” include homes, outbuildings (barns, garages, sheds, etc) and commercial properties destroyed."
…and they don’t count dollars, just numbers. (any one house is equal to every other house)
It sounds like a damaged structure doesn’t figure in those numbers
You’ll also see they have a separate “largest” category which might better fit your liking .
*Numbers not final *DINS Disclaimer: These numbers are preliminary based on aerial assessments dedicating heat sources which can include chicken
coops, outbuildings, sheds, water containers, 5th wheel, etc.
6 Likes
Human history and what is remembered by those who have been writing it down for the last 100+ yrs does not represent an accurate picture of fire history. Ice cores are continuing to prove that very large biomass burning events for a variety of reasons have been occurring in great numbers long before western/European record keeping began. And just like past storms - past fires have been much bigger at times than even now. I also have been questing for such a list/record of past fire history and in doing so came across this document with references. It has Fire & other Wx related events.
Extreme-Climate-Weather-and-Meteorological-Events-Sept.-2017.pdf (761.4 KB)
5 Likes
17 Largest Wildfires in US History | Earth.Org 1871 had the Peshtigo Fire, Wisconsin At least 1,152 people were killed, making this the worst fire that claimed more lives than any of the other wildfires in US history. also Great Michigan Fire 1871. Chicago fire (of Mrs, O’Leary’s cow fame) got all the press that that day
3 Likes
The Palisades and Eaton Fires both may end up as #2 and #3 respectively in terms of structure loss
Prior to the colossally devastating 2018 Camp Fire (which still holds the #1 record) that destroyed 18,000+ buildings and killed 85 people and 2017 when the Tubbs Fire romped through Sonoma County and took 5,636 structures and 22 lives with it – the single most destructive fire in California history for nearly 3 decades was the tiny but devastating Tunnel Fire in the Oakland Hills which had destroyed 2,900 structures and killed 25 people.
Before 2017, the most destructive wildfire in California history was the Tunnel Fire of 1991 followed closely by the Cedar Fire of 2003. All Santa Ana/Diablo Wind driven, by the way.
Not many other areas in America have experienced such massive destruction from wildfires in modern history. Even the insanely deadly fire in Lahaina “only” destroyed 2,200+ structures. I think the single most destructure fire may very well still be the Camp Fire.
10 Likes
I concur. Sadly the Camp never got the attention and coverage it deserved in comparison to what is currently occurring. Make no mistake this is tragic on all levels, but celebrity, money, and certain politics will overshadow past fires that took so many lives and property. If this brings some positive change then bring it on.
7 Likes
Since the Tunnel fire in 1990, over 20,000 structures have been destroyed in California.
Property values have more than tripled in the same time frame.
Minimum wage has more than quadrupled in that same time frame and now sits at $16.50/hr
Meanwhile, the insurance industry can now longer make a profit in California and has been leaving the state in droves. A profit is EVERY person’s motivation when it comes to work. Hence the reason for minimum wage to continue to rise, so people can earn a “livable wage”.
This current disaster won’t end anytime soon, till there is a substantial change in the weather. Which comes back to the point of this post. The ICE CORES tell a different story of the weather, than the written history of the last 100-200 years. Humans and their hubris never seem to see the entire picture or tell the entire story. It takes too much work, time, and effort to actually understand the “Big” picture.
But what has changed in those same 100-200 years? The population of the state, which in turn drives up property values in and ever increasing rate no different than minimum wage & insurance rates.
5 Likes
# 2024 insured nat cat loss bill pegged at $140bn
I hit this site last year about this time and was startled by the reality of what is happening to the insurance business, viewed from data provided by the reinsurance industry. The news is worse for 2024.
While we focus on the short term affects of lack of affordable homeowner insurance, the problem looks larger to me when I step away from myself.
Reinsurance insures the insurance companies. If reinsurance companies cannot endure the losses, then insurance begins to disappear on a much more significant scale. No mortgage insurance, for example, means no mortgages and no mortgages means no mortgage business, which means to mortgage loan industry which means no viable position for out contemporary banking systems.
The implications are dire for a population struggling to be a civilization.
3 Likes
2018 BTU Camp certainly tops many a sorted list for statistical reasons, but some other lessons learned from that tend to be overlooked. Unfortunately/fortunately now we have subject matter expertise out of Butte County in community-devastation human remain searching. Between CSU Chico anthropology dept and BCSAR, they practically wrote the book on that which didn’t formally exist before. Then their processes were validated and proven on the North Complex and Park fires. Now those Butte SME’s are in SoCal prepping to assist to lead similar efforts in a fast and efficient matter, that is if ego/politics of the feds are set aside.
Another lesson out of Camp (well, Rim Fire actually) was large-scale Law Enforcement Mutual Aid (LEMA). Not quite the problem in socal with the number of law enforcement in the urban areas, but still a huge lesson for the non-urban areas of California, how to communicate, how to logistically support, shelter, feed, etc. All stuff the fire side takes for granted today, learned out of Oakland Hills and FireScope etc. I remember being in Tuolumne on the Rim and Roseville PD officer shows up ready for work and was asked if he brought a sleeping bag and tent. The look on his face when he was told there’s nothing here for a 3 hour radius. But what about the (only) hotel in town? 
9 Likes
The list is posted on the Cal Fire web page. See post above for details
2 Likes
Thankfully, So Cal did not have the evacuation troubles that others did. I’m hearing very few reports of folks missing or UTL. Lots of egress routes available and heavy coverage on local radio & 7 different local TV broadcast stations to choose from - all covering fires 24/7. (and at least 4 media helicopters livestreaming) Plus, many hundreds of LE, Fire, EMS and rescue vehicles quickly available into fire area assisting non-ambulatory & nursing home evacuations. No doubt, Life safety priority was key in keeping civilian casualties low. (but it was messy to watch!)
6 Likes
“The Great Miramishi Fire” Also worth some study & remembering…
3 Likes
Latest Updates in these wildfires
3 Likes
Speaking of FIRESCOPE I hear talks of a LAWSCOPE in the works, however I tend to be of the opinion that I’ll believe it when I see it.
3 Likes
I have heard from some higher up local law people, all they can do is laugh about it. Like setting up a perimeter to apprehend somebody in an orderly manner, then CHP comes blazing in to the middle of everything and upsets the whole apple cart. They sure do not have the same mutual aid concept as fire, but also the nature of their work means they hardly get to practice it either, so it does not become second nature to them.
1 Like
I work on the LE side in dispatch and that is completely correct all around!
1 Like